Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

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Tronus
Posts: 40

Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Tronus »

As a player of Classic WoW on retail, i've seen that the Raids and the Dungeons are so easy to do, even with low equip (we have done a full Molten Core with green equip).
So i ask to the dev and if someone agrees with me, to increase the difficulty of raids and dungeons.
One easy way could be just increasing the mobs HP of like 30/40% and their damage of the same percentage or less.
This is the way, if i remember correctly, that Elysium WoW increased the difficulty on their vanilla server.
Thanks for reading, waiting for your opinions. :)
“An eye for an eye will only make the whole world blind.”

Xadas
Posts: 1

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Xadas »

My friends and i would love to see this, at least for Uldaman and up. Archaedas was a joke on retail, elite mobs in general are a joke. Instances and Raids are supposed to be group content. not 2-3 mannable. I suggest buffing HP / Armor / Resistances and Damage about 20%, but also increase Instance xp by about that amount.

Wolfrig
Posts: 6

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Wolfrig »

I came here in order to start this kind of a post, so I'm glad to see others are thinking about it as well.

I'm quite sure that some buffs to dungeons and raids are a MUST have. I have heard of groups of 25 people doing MC on Classic, people going there in green gear and clearing it just fine... Some will say that it's just MC and it simply cannot be challenging again, but why not give it a try?

Lets face it, there is no way to make a blizzlike, authentic vanilla the way it used to be simply because players are not the way they used to be. This is why some rather simple custom changed must be made. Increasing not just the HP, but also damage, and maybe even tweaking some boss ability cooldowns, are some of the ways to at least try and make the encounters more challenging, which would definitely make them more fun to veterans and newcomers alike.

One final thought. Wouldn't any of you like to have a new raid released without it being cleared that same evening? Wouldn't it be fun having an undefeated final boss, a challenge for the entire server to struggle to take down, at least for some time, before it is turned into just another farming spot?

I hope this discussion gains traction, and I hope at least some of the devs have already given this issue some thought.

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Enantiomer
Posts: 2

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Enantiomer »

If dungeon and raid mobs/bosses get buffed, then so should ret paladins, moonkins, prot paladins, etc. Most of the reason why everyone clears everything so easily is because so many people confer to the meta. Of course the game is really easy if you use the same classes, specs, strategies that are known to work for 16 years.

I had a poor experience with some raids in TBC because of the weird boosts to most bosses, and I would love to be able to actually play some raids as a casual player for a change. I don't think it would be fun having an undefeatable boss that needs strong commitment to the game to take a shot at. The game isn't hard and it isn't complex mechanic wise - it's pretty much a cookie-clicker that's really fun when highly intoxicated.

I think if you want a challenge, why not play a new game (maybe Shadowlands?) or try playing the game in a non-conventional way (try killing Ragnaros within a time limit. Try killing two bosses at once. Try it without a tank.).

The main point I'm making is that increasing difficulty in such a manner simply forces everyone into boring metas, and does little to actually increase enjoyment in the game.

Wolfrig
Posts: 6

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Wolfrig »

I kind of assume that everyone is "forcing" themselves into metas anyway, or at least into the very optimal versions of their characters, and unsurprisingly so, given our knowledge/experience and easy access to loads of information. I've seen and heard about some really funny/suboptimal builds/gears/playstyles, but these days such things would mostly be frowned upon by all guilds save for the really casual ones.

I'm not a dev and I had never worked as one, so a general suggestion is all I can offer. I do, however, believe that some compromise can be found between trivial cakewalk and mind-numbing, meta-enforcing marathon that is entertaining to no one. What's the point of all these new vanilla pservers if they are not even gonna try to spice things up a little bit? We're playing a 15 year old game, we might as well add a bit of personal touch into the whole thing.

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Tronus
Posts: 40

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Tronus »

Wolfrig wrote:
Tue Jun 30, 2020 5:45 pm
I came here in order to start this kind of a post, so I'm glad to see others are thinking about it as well.

I'm quite sure that some buffs to dungeons and raids are a MUST have. I have heard of groups of 25 people doing MC on Classic, people going there in green gear and clearing it just fine... Some will say that it's just MC and it simply cannot be challenging again, but why not give it a try?

Lets face it, there is no way to make a blizzlike, authentic vanilla the way it used to be simply because players are not the way they used to be. This is why some rather simple custom changed must be made. Increasing not just the HP, but also damage, and maybe even tweaking some boss ability cooldowns, are some of the ways to at least try and make the encounters more challenging, which would definitely make them more fun to veterans and newcomers alike.

One final thought. Wouldn't any of you like to have a new raid released without it being cleared that same evening? Wouldn't it be fun having an undefeated final boss, a challenge for the entire server to struggle to take down, at least for some time, before it is turned into just another farming spot?

I hope this discussion gains traction, and I hope at least some of the devs have already given this issue some thought.
"Wouldn't it be fun having an undefeated final boss, at least for some time...", i completely agree with this phrase and i think this should be the concept of Vanilla.

If you do not want to buff the dungeons ok, too much work. But the raids need to be buffed. Their difficulty need to be increased, to give new lifeblood to the game and more competition to players. In Vanilla Ragnaros was alive for like 3 months, try to recreate those feelings guys.... :)
“An eye for an eye will only make the whole world blind.”

Wolfrig
Posts: 6

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Wolfrig »

The way I see it, even if you want to recreate the original vanilla feel, you should be interested in tuning raids up a little bit. If for no other reason, then at least to make up for the fact that we have 1.12. talents for 1.2 content, which people obviously did not have for most of vanilla.

You wanna recreate vanilla even thought the key component (the playerbase) cannot be recreated? Some custom changed will have to be made.

Now, I do realise that this issue is not a priority for now. It won't help you start and maintain a healthy server early on, so maybe that is why it is not getting much attention for now. But it is an important issue that is very simple to resolve, and will have positive effects in the long run.

Captain
Posts: 7

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Captain »

If the server ends up hovering with a low population at average times, this is going to be the death knell to the server. A decision like this can't be put in place unless there's like 1.5k people online at any time.

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Tronus
Posts: 40

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Tronus »

Old Vanilla online players were like around 500, so i think if we double this number is a very good point to reach.
“An eye for an eye will only make the whole world blind.”

Ardy
Posts: 4

Re: Increase difficulty on Raids and Dungeons

Post by Ardy »

No challenge = no fun!
So if you want people to have fun you literally have to make it hard, this is a key component of why vanilla was great, and why classic is not great.

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